Ya'll are stupid
Honestly, XIII was a failed experiment to me. All Shine and no substance. That and no Nobuo Uematsu.
Personally, my Favorite FFs are FFVIII (Flame Shield Activate! Defensive Power! 120%!) and FFV (weak story imo, but they perfected the job system in that one.)
ಠ_ಠ
I kinda feel the same, but sometimes the failed experiment is so flawed, you start thinking that they never play tested it even once to see if they gameplay works at all.Originally Posted by Cresset
Super Moderator
Don't like Auto battle, don't use it.
(Psst, in FFVII you could hold down O and finish all the fights that way without selecting anything. You can easily finish the entire game without doing anything but holding O in battle. There's even a tutorial that tells you this. )
E.G.G.M.A.N.
I'll grant I didn't know that you were told about that (or that it even worked), but frankly, I think that's pushing it for FF7. There are fights where you can't get away with just attacking, in my opinion. Putting that aside though, Final Fantasy XIII's battle system doesn't lend itself well to selecting everything you want to do separately. Final Fantasy VII's system did. Of course, this is my opinion, and perhaps I'm just too slow, but the battle system is simply too fast-paced to be able to get away with selecting everything separately in the uncomfortable menu system. Menu systems are fine like this, if the battle isn't real time. If the battle speed paused while you were selecting abilities, I'd happily ignore the auto-battle button for the rest of my life, but sadly, it doesn't.
Like I said, perhaps it's me, perhaps not, but I feel the battle system is so poorly designed that using auto-battle (or auto-heal) is the only truly viable solution in many fights, especially because if you don't use it, you get pounded into the dirt because you can never match the game's speed. Or at least I can't.
Super Moderator
The same can be said about XIII. Trying to auto battle through mark hunts/certain boss fights gets you killed. Likewise random encounters in VII had bullshit abilities that made mashing attack necessary (Y HALO THAR 666 ON EARLY GAME ENEMIES). Just because "Auto Battle" replaces "Attack" doesn't make it any different.I'll grant I didn't know that you were told about that (or that it even worked
Like I said, perhaps it's me, perhaps not, but I feel the battle system is so poorly designed that using auto-battle (or auto-heal) is the only truly viable solution in many fights, especially because if you don't use it, you get pounded into the dirt because you can never match the game's speed. Or at least I can't.
You can slow down the battle system. It's under the settings menu. I can't see the slowest setting being too fast for anyone that isn't part snail.
E.G.G.M.A.N.
Fair enough, I suppose, and I concede your point about the battle speed settings. I could list more things I dislike about XIII's system, but it'll be a discussion without end, I suspect. Suffice it to say I feel that the battle system there is inherently flawed in multiple ways, whereas FF7's - while in no way being the be-all and end-all of battle systems - worked on most fronts so you could pick your own strategy more calmly and effectively. I just don't feel I have that kind of control in XIII. Damnit I'm off on it again anyway, aren't I?
Also, I must admit: "666 on early game enemies"? Which enemies are we talking about here? The only enemy that approximates that kind of damage in very early game is the Midgar Zolom. The one you're pretty much supposed to avoid completely. Following that, the first enemy that can actually reach that would be the ones you get in Junon if you activate the alarm system that triggers powerful enemies to spawn - sorry, but that's yer own fault. Then, going through the game in my head, the only enemies that'll be able to inflict that kind of damage will be the spiders in the caves under Cosmo Canyon. That's not really early-game anymore, if I'm completely honest.
Last edited by Dr. Ivo Robotnik; 29th-December-2011 at 18:15.
Super Moderator
The penguin enemies that you encounter randomly on the second continent (mostly near Cosmo Canyon). They have a guaranteed attack that pulls 666 damage if you let them attack. Which is roughly max health at that point.
Or then there's FFVIII where using skills meant having to stockpile them first. Or unlock them. Which frequently meant grinding. Which usually involved mashing Attack.
Immortal
Agreed. FF VIII takes grinding to a whole new level...The penguin enemies that you encounter randomly on the second continent (mostly near Cosmo Canyon). They have a guaranteed attack that pulls 666 damage if you let them attack. Which is roughly max health at that point.
Or then there's FFVIII where using skills meant having to stockpile them first. Or unlock them. Which frequently meant grinding. Which usually involved mashing Attack.
About FF XIII. The battles are no so fast that you cannot manage them yourself. It's just that there are some battles (like the boss at the Gapra Whitewoods), do require you to use auto-battle instead of selecting your attacks manually, BUT that does not mean you'll be smashing at the auto-battle button. You have to think first. FF XIII's AI is really useful and the best one i've ever seen. The best strategy is to cast Libra to reveal the enemy's weaknessess and then the AI will act accordingly. Switch roles using the paradigm shift to best fit your needs during the fights. You won't be smashing at the auto-battle button as much if you think first. It is there for your character to choose the best set of skills to use without wasting any time so that you can focus on your strategy. Also, i've read your "review". I cannot call it review because it has too much personal opinion on it. Also, you didn't finish the game. The ending is pretty awesome, one of the best endings in my opinion. I must say i didn't expect that. About the sidequests, yes, they are much like XII's quests. Receive quest, hunt down monster, get your reward. But don't forget some quests unlock some neat information on the datalog, enchancing the story even more. All previous FF's were linear, the only difference is that XIII takes it to the extremes (you only gain freedom to explore near the end of the game). XIII has no villages or cities for you to visit, filled with NPCs to actually "interact" with (we all know that all FF NPCs repeat themselves), but it fits perfectly with the story, which is a good one in my opinion, but that is my opinion, since they are fugitives, the whole world hates them, and Pulse is a desolated place filled with strong monsters. If you uncover some parts of the datalog that tells about what happened to the humans in Pulse, you'll see that it makes sense.On your head be it. It's bloody lengthy, but I hope it amuses: Long-ass link so typing something else to click. Which is now probably longer than the link. Damnit I'm counterproductive.
E.G.G.M.A.N.
Oh yes. Rage Bomber. Used when you attack them with a physical attack.The penguin enemies that you encounter randomly on the second continent (mostly near Cosmo Canyon). They have a guaranteed attack that pulls 666 damage if you let them attack. Which is roughly max health at that point.
Or then there's FFVIII where using skills meant having to stockpile them first. Or unlock them. Which frequently meant grinding. Which usually involved mashing Attack.
*cough*
Final Fantasy VIII has a battle system that I find silly all over, so I'll pass on commenting there or I'll be writing all night
Oh, I know the paradigm shifting system comes into play, and while I approve of the versatility it gives you, for me as the player it often merely swapped me from auto-battle to auto-heal. Yes, there's strategy involved, but my control of the action feels loose at best.
On the note of the review - any review is an opinionative article. And I know I didn't finish the game. I'm in the final dungeon, but no matter how awesome the ending, I cannot force myself to play those last few hours required for the final dungeon. That says a great deal about the appeal the game has to me. An inability to finish a game due to heavy dislike of the game's mechanics is as valid a review point as finishing the game because you adored it.
I'll admit I wasn't aware that the side-quests, sorry, side-quest, gave additional datalog entries. I do approve of additional information not entirely necessary to the main plot. My primary annoyance with the datalog is that the main storyline was halfway incomprehensible if you ignore the datalog. That, to me, is poor storytelling. And I never claimed the Pulse storyline made no sense. I merely claimed that the primary storyline was an awkward one at best. Again, this is how it came across to me, and how I experienced it. And as with the final dungeon - I don't want to have to go through the same repetitive side-quest again and again and again, even if it unlocks an interesting bit of story. The reward doesn't even remotely compare to the necessary effort. Who knows, maybe I'm doing it wrong, but at least SOME diversion would've been nice at any point, but you never ever get out of the "walk, fight, walk, fight, walk, fight, watch fabulous cutscene, walk, fight" grind. There is nothing else to do. Linearity I can live with. This took it to extremes.
EDIT: I just realised that we haven't just taken this thread off-topic, we've practically carried it into the next CONTINENT we took it so far. Let's move on and discuss this in another place?
EDIT 2: Incidentally, no offense is intended with what I say. I tend to get passionate about these kinds of things, and while I think I've prevented being offensive, if I was, it was not my intent.
Last edited by Dr. Ivo Robotnik; 29th-December-2011 at 20:43.
Immortal
[QUOPTE]EDIT 2: Incidentally, no offense is intended with what I say. I tend to get passionate about these kinds of things, and while I think I've prevented being offensive, if I was, it was not my intent.[/QUOTE]
No harm done or taken. But i do have to apologize since my statements seems a bit offensive (i've noticed it while reading over my previous replies and i do apologize for that).
Oh yes. Rage Bomber. Used when you attack them with a physical attack.
*cough*
Final Fantasy VIII has a battle system that I find silly all over, so I'll pass on commenting there or I'll be writing all night
Oh, I know the paradigm shifting system comes into play, and while I approve of the versatility it gives you, for me as the player it often merely swapped me from auto-battle to auto-heal. Yes, there's strategy involved, but my control of the action feels loose at best.
On the note of the review - any review is an opinionative article. And I know I didn't finish the game. I'm in the final dungeon, but no matter how awesome the ending, I cannot force myself to play those last few hours required for the final dungeon. That says a great deal about the appeal the game has to me. An inability to finish a game due to heavy dislike of the game's mechanics is as valid a review point as finishing the game because you adored it.
I'll admit I wasn't aware that the side-quests, sorry, side-quest, gave additional datalog entries. I do approve of additional information not entirely necessary to the main plot. My primary annoyance with the datalog is that the main storyline was halfway incomprehensible if you ignore the datalog. That, to me, is poor storytelling. And I never claimed the Pulse storyline made no sense. I merely claimed that the primary storyline was an awkward one at best. Again, this is how it came across to me, and how I experienced it. And as with the final dungeon - I don't want to have to go through the same repetitive side-quest again and again and again, even if it unlocks an interesting bit of story. The reward doesn't even remotely compare to the necessary effort. Who knows, maybe I'm doing it wrong, but at least SOME diversion would've been nice at any point, but you never ever get out of the "walk, fight, walk, fight, walk, fight, watch fabulous cutscene, walk, fight" grind. There is nothing else to do. Linearity I can live with. This took it to extremes.
EDIT: I just realised that we haven't just taken this thread off-topic, we've practically carried it into the next CONTINENT we took it so far. Let's move on and discuss this in another place?
No need to. It was kinda my fault the thread started move away from the topic, so i'll stop it here
Also, iv'e been reading this interesting article:
<a href="http://www.gamesradar.com/why-every-final-fantasy-game-is-the-best-and-worst-in-the-series/">Why every Final Fantasy game is the best and the worst in the series</a>
P.S. I think the one who wrote that article never played FF X. You'll see if you read his vague statements about it.
Now, to remain on-topic: I think SE needs better management of their teams. For one, they said that the amount of cuts FF XIII had was enough to make a whole new game, i remember reading somewhere that they had towns and such things planned and nearly ready, but they had them cut because they had a deadline and didn't want to keep their fans waiting. But, as was said earlier, they've been cranking 1 FF game every one or two years already, so it's not big news. But what we can infer from that is that they might be trying to improve their management skills. Because even if you have short deadlines, several teams working on several parts of a game or several games, without good management, everything goes to hell and they release not so good games or even horrible ones.
Last edited by rulucian; 29th-December-2011 at 21:09.
E.G.G.M.A.N.
No harm done or taken. But i do have to apologize since my statements seems a bit offensive (i've noticed it while reading over my previous replies and i do apologize for that).
No need to. It was kinda my fault the thread started move away from the topic, so i'll stop it here
Also, iv'e been reading this interesting article:
<a href="http://www.gamesradar.com/why-every-final-fantasy-game-is-the-best-and-worst-in-the-series/">Why every Final Fantasy game is the best and the worst in the series</a>
P.S. I think the one who wrote that article never played FF X. You'll see if you read his vague statements about it.
Now, to remain on-topic: I think SE needs better management of their teams. For one, they said that the amount of cuts FF XIII had was enough to make a whole new game, i remember reading somewhere that they had towns and such things planned and nearly ready, but they had them cut because they had a deadline and didn't want to keep their fans waiting. But, as was said earlier, they've been cranking 1 FF game every one or two years already, so it's not big news. But what we can infer from that is that they might be trying to improve their management skills. Because even if you have short deadlines, several teams working on several parts of a game or several games, without good management, everything goes to hell and they release not so good games or even horrible ones.[/QUOTE]
Much obliged. I'll have a look at your article in a bit (I'm sorta in the middle of a raid in WoW, but too bored with the tactics for a boss I know how to kill, so I'm posting in the meantime. Yes, I'm a sod
I'm pretty much ranted out on the main topic at hand, so I'll leave it in your capable hand. Though I do agree with you on this score as well. I'm not sure if it's the teams, per se, but I do agree that there is something that's gone wrong somewhere
Why so many final fantasies is beyond me and they are leaving their other franchises untouched. I want to see a xenogears remake a new chrono trigger. Don't know why square doesn't freshen up the games before people get bored.
Immortal
Nope. People won't get bored. Each FF is a brand new game with brand new mechanics, characters, storyline, etc. So people won't get bored. About remaking Chrono Trigger (BEST RPG EVER), i don't think they'd do that, because of many reasons: CT is good the way it is; it would take too much time (even though they have a storyline, they'd have to make a brand new game. Current generation games cost a lot of money. Remakes are good for them, and any other gaming company, if they can make the most profit from it with the littlest amount of resource spent. In other words: Too much money for a remake equals a big NO.)
Same goes for Xenogears.
Some remakes will make money. I can speak for myself when i say i was disappointed with the second disk with xenogears when everything became story time and the action and movement was severely limited. That is something in my opinion that needs fixing. People have been crying for an ff 7 remake i say give the people what they want. Nintendo can make remake after remake and make money off it square can do the same cause their games are apart of the generation where remakes can feel like a whole new experience.
Immortal
Perhaps you're right. About FF VII, i think they already squeezed all the money they could from it (Crisis Core, Dirge of Cerberus, etc.).
FF III was the best remake i ever played. They remade everything except for the story (they just corrected a few things).
but it was a not a current generation remake. They m,ight make a FF VI or VII remake for a portable maybe. Nintendo needs better franchises. They are getting repetitive (Mario Party 8 - same mechanics with a few extras and refined touches). But this thread is not about Nintendo, so you'll forget all about what i just said about Nintendo and focus on the thread related part!
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