Bush Or Kerry

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Originally Posted by karragh

okay, fair enough, if you want to say CBS, NBC, and ABC are liberal, can you find me an example or two of them being praticularly so, then i will se if i can find examples of fox being praticularly conservative....

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NBC (Browkaw) and ABC (Jennings) backing up Rather on his false documents. Whatever happened to journalistic rivalry?

Im not denying Fox has being conservative, but it is more moderate than most.

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Originally Posted by Fett aka hmm

NBC (Browkaw) and ABC (Jennings) backing up Rather on his false documents. Whatever happened to journalistic rivalry?

Im not denying Fox has being conservative, but it is more moderate than most.

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oh few, glad about that last line, i was worried i'd actually have to go to the effort of research...

anyhow, that is individual people there, it is very hard for a reporter to not have some degree of editorialism, but you have to actually look at the network head to see the general beliefs of the network, or the kind of stories that are told...

ah, i just remembered something, whatever network it was the had the superbowl on it, refused to show an add that was anti-bush... that doesn't sound liberal.(just thought I'd throw an example of something i can remember without doing research)(I am aware it wasn't about fox, but oh well..)

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Originally Posted by gfx.

Call me uninformed, but what the fuck is so bad about being liberal? or moderate? or fucking communist, for that matter?

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An even better question would be: what the fuck is so bad about being conservative?

I'm just trying to counter the overwhelming amount of arguments here against conservatism, Bush, and America. This site is frequented mostly by those that lean toward the Left. I just wanted to drop by and say my piece so that this place won't be shilling completely for Kerry.

I have nothing against moderates. I like Lieberman, McCain(I wanted him to be Prez in 2000 instead of Bush), and Schwarzennegar.

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Originally Posted by reagan80

An even better question would be: what the fuck is so bad about being conservative?

I'm just trying to counter the overwhelming amount of arguments here against conservatism, Bush, and America.

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heh, most "anti-america" posts you see, are actually anti to the countries actions, and therefor actually just anti bush, i don't think there many poeple here who are just plain anti america.





Edit: oh, and to that other persons post, "what is so wrong with communism?"..... we need to have a long talk.

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Originally Posted by karragh

ah, i just remembered something, whatever network it was the had the superbowl on it, refused to show an add that was anti-bush... that doesn't sound liberal.(just thought I'd throw an example of something i can remember without doing research)(I am aware it wasn't about fox, but oh well..)

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With a little bit of research, I can say with a fair amount of confidence it was CBS.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4114703/

for anyone who cares.

Oh, and for the record, being liberal doesn't mean you are anti-America.

Edit: Grrr...will this rise again?

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Originally Posted by Xaenn

Edit: Grrr...will this rise again?

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was that in reference to

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Edit: oh, and to that other persons post, "what is so wrong with communism?"..... we need to have a long talk.

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Originally Posted by reagan80

An even better question would be: what the fuck is so bad about being conservative?

I'm just trying to counter the overwhelming amount of arguments here against conservatism, Bush, and America. This site is frequented mostly by those that lean toward the Left. I just wanted to drop by and say my piece so that this place won't be shilling completely for Kerry.

I have nothing against moderates. I like Lieberman, McCain(I wanted him to be Prez in 2000 instead of Bush), and Schwarzennegar.

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That does not, in any way, answer my question. it doesn't even make an attempt at it.

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Originally Posted by gfx.

That does not, in any way, answer my question. it doesn't even make an attempt at it.

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well, if you want an answer to the whats so bad about being communist part, read my posts in the commy guild, other then that, I agree with you, nothing wrong with liberalness.

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Originally Posted by karragh

well, if you want an answer to the whats so bad about being communist part, read my posts in the commy guild, other then that, I agree with you, nothing wrong with liberalness.

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Will do. I've actualy did a bit of reading and I've come to the conclusion that in Communism, EVERYONE is middle class, or something like that. It's a failed system, but it was a nice theory.

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Originally Posted by Soeru

Edit: Of course Americans were hated well before Bush was in office. Here is the problem: Bush hasn't done shit to improve international relationships. He's only enfuriated middle Easterns even further after invading Iraq.

More examples of international-relation fuck-ups:Take a look at Kim-Jung-Il, Vladimir Putin, and countless other governors from small countries you've probably never heard of.

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I know that Kim-Jung-Il is wrong in the head, and you can't put Bush to blame for that. what's wrong with Putin? Also middle eastern countries that support terrorism sort of brought this upon themselves. Bush is keeping us safer than we were before Sept. 11. If you don't agree with that then answer me this, when was the last time we were attacked since 9/11?

Karragh: Yes

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Bush is keeping us safer than we were before Sept. 11. If you don't agree with that then answer me this, when was the last time we were attacked since 9/11?

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You know that that is completely flawed logic. I'm not sure which fallacy but I'm sure someone else can point it out.

By that logic. On december 3rd, 2002, my father had a heart attack. Since then he has eated 32 pounds of whipped cream daily. He hasn't had a heart attack since...clearly whipped cream prevents heart attacks.

I'll let someone else tear that apart...

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Originally Posted by MusikFreak00

Right, not all people that came here first were because of religious freedom. Saying that would be stereotyping. What my point was is the definition of 'Separation of Church and State' is a different definition now that what it was when this country was founded. And like I said, I don't think our definition is bad, I just think it's ridiculous when someone pulls the separation of Church and State card whenever a leader (president, senator, representative, teacher, federal employee, judge, etc.) makes a comment about God. What's so offensive about it? It's not like just because the president's christian that he's only gonna take advice from the pope or other leaders of the Christian religion. If he did, abortions would be outlawed, there would be no death penalty, and no anything else that christianity is against.



I agree, I didn't say that I am against having gay marriage, I gave you the argument that a lot of people have in their minds. It's still Taboo to people who think marriage is a union between a man and a woman only. And that may never change. Civil Unions/gay marriage would not bother me at all. But I am not gonna actively go out and seek to legalize it. I just don't feel that strongly about it.

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Well it look's like we agree then.

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Originally Posted by Xaenn

Karragh: Yes



You know that that is completely flawed logic. I'm not sure which fallacy but I'm sure someone else can point it out.

By that logic. On december 3rd, 2002, my father had a heart attack. Since then he has eated 32 pounds of whipped cream daily. He hasn't had a heart attack since...clearly whipped cream prevents heart attacks.

I'll let someone else tear that apart...

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Sorry about the double post, i do love flawed logic... P.S. Americans are getting attacked by Terrorist every day... It is an war after all.

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Originally Posted by leatherman

Bush is keeping us safer than we were before Sept. 11. If you don't agree with that then answer me this, when was the last time we were attacked since 9/11?

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I don't know� practically every day? We've lost over a thousand troops in Iraq; I consider that to be a pretty colossal loss of life. That�s about a third as many people as we lost in the WTC attack. Not to mention we have troops and civilians getting kidnapped in Iraq regularly. Would either of these things happened if we hadn�t gone into Iraq? No. We didn�t have nearly this degree of trouble in Afghanistan.

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Originally Posted by Mason

I don't know� practically every day? We've lost over a thousand troops in Iraq; I consider that to be a pretty colossal loss of life. That�s about a third as many people as we lost in the WTC attack. Not to mention we have troops and civilians getting kidnapped in Iraq regularly. Would either of these things happened if we hadn�t gone into Iraq? No. We didn�t have nearly this degree of trouble in Afghanistan.

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Correct you are. I see that you are also opposed to the war in Iraq, eh? Or are you just opposing Bush? Either way, I am with you.

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Originally Posted by gfx.

Correct you are. I see that you are also opposed to the war in Iraq, eh? Or are you just opposing Bush? Either way, I am with you.

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I'm definitely against Bush, I'll fully admit I'm biased in that regard.

Opposed to the war in Iraq? Well, that's kinda tricky. It was good to get Saddam out of power, he was a tyrant and deserved to be taken down. However, the way in which the US went about it was completely wrong. We shouldn't have gone in there alone like some kind of global police force. So, yeah. I have mixed feelings on the matter. It's one of those "do the ends justify the means?" type questions.

I believe I was asked that question previously, and I said that the ends did justify the means. However, I've since changed my mind. Mainly because the 'means' that we've used to achieve the 'ends' has brought about so many deaths. Both in Coalition and Iraqi citizens and troops.